Topic: Generating battle brothers

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  • #6221
    Avatar photoBottlebrother

    Dear developers and brothers,

    First time participant but long time follower… Honestly I love the game and all the effort and enthusiasm the creators offer. It really shows that this is a game for fans by fans!
    I have no problem with the Goblins, they are tough but the devs will surely find a balance that is fun and feasible!
    However I really think there is a problem with the new way we use the skill points when getting in higher levels.
    It makes no sense to have the stats increase by the same amount every try – this way you do not have to invest the points into stats at all but could just make 3 fixed stats increase by a fixed amount according to the brothers´ job with every upgrade.

    The “old” solution was much more fun and added some randomness and really this shitty thief you hired at the beginning due to lack of money could turn out very good when you were lucky. I think that although it is of course more likely for a swordmaster to have better melee than a thief (for example) it made this occasion very special… Thus such a thing (a farmer better than a knight) should of course be rare but should NOT be impossible…

    I thought about what I would do and here is my 20 Eurocents (I am from Germany too, so no normal 50 cents available) of how to maybe make leveling more fun but also keeping it realistic:

    Roll 1W4 (dice with numbers 1 – 4) and add or subtract a fixed number -1 to +1 depending on the characters background…

    Some examples:
    1. I’d give a “Farmer” + 1 when rolling on fatigue, +1 when rolling on health but -1 on rolls on resolve and melee weapon.
    2. “Hunter” +1 on missle weapon, +1 on missle defence and -1 on melee weapon and -1 on melee defence.
    3. “Swordmaster” +1 on melee, +1 on melee defence but -1 on fatigue and -1 on health (given that he was an old master from the beginning ).
    4. “Killer” on the run +1 on fatigue, +1 on initiative, -1 on missle defence and -1 on missle attack

    On all other stats they get +/- 0 meaning a result of 1-4 on each roll. I’d make the minimum 1 so even with a -1 base roll a 1 should still count as 1…

    AND – you should not make any stat raise higher than +1 or lower than -1 BUT of course a headge knight might have +1 on melee attach, melee defence, resolve and health…

    And here some more ideas on character “creation”…

    Have the battle brothers start with 1 preset perk according to their background. This will lead up to ONE more perks when they reach 11 or you could even have them end with 10 but have them level up skill points right when hired in level 1!

    Although I’d much prefer a higher level barrier and another skill tree (weapon skills maybe) giving the brothers one starting perk will make a difference in the way you perceive the character and maybe even in the way you level up — here my 4 examples again:

    1.”Farmer” gets Colossus perk to show how fuckin healthy he is living and working outside always
    2.”Hunter” gets Pathfinder as he is basically a ranger
    3.”Swordmaster” gets Doge as he is more or less fighting without shield
    4.”Killer on the run“ would get taunt (as he is a madman) and wants to mock authorities

    I think it would be pretty easy to find fitting perks and modification for the stat rolls for each character background…

    Those just some thoughts… Would be great to hear what you guys think…

    Of course it might well be that the developers are aware about how the new system offers so less fun (it sucks!!!) and will change it anyway soon but as it is now, the leveling (tremendous joy before) is now more or less boring and useless!

    Avatar photoRusBear

    Yes. i had suggestion like this
    I see that these ideas come into not only my head :).
    maybe it means that it is not so bad…

    Avatar photoBottlebrother

    Yes, your suggestion also features sill points related to class… Happy that the devs get the input and trust them that they’ll pick what seems best fitted to their needs/game… I only think that this game has SO MANY opportunities of having easy but complex character “creation”… It is all right there in the basics. They only have to pimp it up a bit ;-)

    Avatar photoBottlebrother

    …*skill points*… — sorry!

    Avatar photoPsenBattle

    Hey Bottlebrother,
    thanks for your thought through suggestions, its an interesting read.
    I dont just want to “drown” this topic, but part of it will be handled with the rework of the whole perk system we want to do sometime during the worldmap rework.

    Maybe I can clarify something here:
    Old system: Random stat gain on each level up, depending on the stat. For example 2-4 point gain per level.
    New system: Everybody gets the same amount for the same stat. Example: Melee skill +2 per level. Hitpoint +4 per level.
    There is no difference between backgrounds, the same numbers for everybody.

    This was neccessary to keep people from save-scumming and reloading until they scored the maximum point gain on all stats. Apart from that the range was too big. 4 points or 2, that double the points if you are lucky which is pretty unfair.


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    Avatar photoBottlebrother

    Dear PsenBattle,

    Thank you for replying – this why I think you devs are so great because you really take your time and even if a suggestion is stupid (mine is of course NOT) – you take your time to explain your reasoning…

    I understand why you did what you did but I still think it is a bad idea. The older system made leveling so much more enjoyable, even if you rolled shit!
    Hell I admit that I, too, “cheated” once or twice if the overall results were really horrible and – why not?

    On the other side of the spectrum I had a great swordmaster who always rolled the 2 on melee attack but rolled well on defense – it goes without saying I kept him this way and renamed him “Blind-Justice” – he was not the best hitter but did really never got hit himself due to the “Nimble” perk…

    I mean – the dice rolling makes them so much more human – both, the good as much as on the bad results. The brothers are not generic but have flaws. You are just taking options away from players, decisions on how they want to play, you know…

    And it is not really “unfair” as it is a single player game – you are cheating to no one but yourself…

    I do not want to bicker but would still prefer it to not “down” this discussion as I think we might gather some good ideas here…

    But I will of course accept whatever solution will finally be in the game and will be anxiously awaiting your perk system update!

    Thanx again!

    Avatar photoPsenBattle

    You are making some good points. I personally also enjoyed the randomness and was happy with what I got. I liked that the character would develop a bit in his own way, whithout me controling verything.

    Apart from the “unfairness” the plan we have for the new perk system wouldnt work with random stat gain. So we are not considering going back to that at the moment.

    PS: I cant always reply in appropriate depth, but I try :)


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    Avatar photoBottlebrother

    Looking forward to that new perk system! You got me intrigued!

    Cheers to you too!

    Avatar photoWolves

    The new levelup system is soo much more enjoyable to me, because it doesn’t break my immersion through powerplay.
    But I’m also against hidden stats ingame, because they only mean that I have to read them out of the data files or test them =)

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    Avatar photoBottlebrother

    I see your point and it might have been different for me too, if we did not have this “FREEDOM” first – now it seems as if the devs took something precious away! :-)

    Avatar photoPsenBattle

    now it seems as if the devs took something precious away!

    Hehe, sometimes we have to :)

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