Topic: My Thoughts (long)

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  • #16265
    Avatar photogrimaldi

    Man, what a great game! Even in early access I played the heck out of it, bought it for friends and family, and they’ve all played the crap out of it as well! Anyway, my thoughts on what to add or expand upon:

    1- Character customization: Always a nice touch, but much like Xcom, I find I don’t do it much because characters either die too often (so not worth the investment time) or once they’re highly leveled, they already have some personality. The new Xcom addressed this pretty well: separate option in game menu to make characters that populate the world, and I think this would go well with this game.

    2- Naturally occurring character perks: It’s nice to level people up and pick perks, but characters feel more “real” with perks that develop over time. The game already has some of this…I had one great “gluttonous” character that would go back and forth between being “fat”, and his struggles with weight were amusing. More good (and bad) events like this would be great, whether random or event based (fail several panic checks in a row, character might be cowardly and get a permanent morale loss. Several hits to the head in a row, gets some headhunter perk, etc).

    3- Level-cap/end game: Obviously the end-game/objective has yet to be worked out, but artificial level caps are annoying, even if they make sense from a game-balance perspective. Instead, maybe much slower leveling after 11, combined with much higher salary. Add in permanent injuries, and maybe personal goals (more money, more challenging missions, leave for personal reasons). For me, the best part of the game is the early game struggle to build a team despite losses and such…once a strong team is developed, challenge is gone. Higher salaries, permanent injury, etc would keep the roster changing and force the same tough choices from the early game to the late game. In fact, seeing a high-level character that leaves your party appear in one of the merc bands that confronts you later would be pretty awesome.

    4- To help with the above, it seems enemy challenge is based off of game date? Maybe having some regions be safer/easier than others, just like real life, where bands can be rebuilt, and then higher-level (and more expensive) warbands can go to more dangerous areas with warring factions, wild beasts in the hinterlands, etc.

    5- It seems like early game progression might be a bit too fast. Your company very quickly progresses past first and second tier weapons, almost to the point that there’s little reason to include them. I do like the fact that weapon tier increases are relatively small, and yet make a significant difference in effectiveness. Even the named weapons provide only a small buff over top tier stuff, and yet they’re still worth it. Named shields (and, I assume, armor) being easy to have destroyed is a bit annoying…they might be worth repairing, even at a significant cost.

    6- Weapons overall are great. You could nitpick endlessly over how they’d really work, but in general they’re true to reality, balanced, and distinct enough to encourage multiple play styles. One weapon differentiation you might want to consider to further differentiate the “reach” weapons: something long like a pike, well better balanced for long ranged attacks, would be cumbersome for a close opponent, while a billhook or ax would be much more effective. Maybe bonuses/penalties to hit in adjacent tiles, similar to the patch adding bonus to hit for the pike.

    7- The increasing number of random events that can occur, both within and outside of missions, are great, and keep adding to the adventure and unpredictability. Keep it up! When confronted by enemy bands in some of these events (mercs want the package you’re transporting, a bandit leader head you have, etc), your forced to make a decision to fight without info on the enemy. Just like most encounters, you should get the little info screen letting you know what the enemy has.

    8- Do most players use two-handed weapons (not reach, but greatswords and such)? Those characters just seem too vulnerable. I may have them with a character with a reach weapon, to quick-hands swap to if an enemy gets in base contact, but otherwise I almost never use them. Maybe some slight tweaks to make single-handed weapons a little less effective, and two-handed ones a bit more powerful?

    9- Great job on enemy AI for difference factions. Orcs, undead and goblins all play very differently, which is fun (and annoying, in the case of goblins. I hate those guys…)

    10- I feel bad that many “classes” of characters seem to have no reason to hire, especially in the later game. Some of them have event-type benefits, which are great and should be expanded, but in general, there are some classes that are just better to hire, when the idea of a motley group of people from all-walks of life being forged into a merc company seems more fitting, thematically. Maybe some of the benefits from the “combat” classes just get translated in more level-ups upon hire? I suppose a swordmaster may naturally have a higher melee attack and defense (explaining how he survived to be “master” level), but a raider or hedge knight? Are they naturally gifted, or do they just have more experience, which really just translates into more levels?

    Avatar photogoldenbannermen

    8- Do most players use two-handed weapons (not reach, but greatswords and such)? Those characters just seem too vulnerable. I may have them with a character with a reach weapon, to quick-hands swap to if an enemy gets in base contact, but otherwise I almost never use them. Maybe some slight tweaks to make single-handed weapons a little less effective, and two-handed ones a bit more powerful?

    well IMO, i think 2H weapon is great especially using greatsword and placed in the rear where he can hit up to 3 guys with his AoE without injuring other brothers, i especially like long reach 2H weapon like long axe and billhook, very usefull against orcs. especially used by crosbowman (usually sellsword background).
    2H weapons are also great combined with high stamina (for heavier armor) brother like wildling and hedge knight.

    but mostly i think 2H is situational, usually i switch to 2h when they already in reach

    Avatar photogoldenbannermen

    the circled one have long reach 2H in bag :)

    usually my line up placed like this

    Avatar photoRusBear

    the weakness of the two-handed weapons in the game (not to mention 2 tile weapon) based on the mechanics of the game. you have only one attack and strongly depends on the rnd. you have no protective options or a counter, nothing – while the shield and sword, and often allow you to attack and defend in one move. all the mechanics is based on the damage done and not getting it back. therefore, 2 hands would nice any additional options – Front protective, preparation counter attack and so on. Of course this does not stop the real fans and RPG players) I, for example, from the first day use 2 hand axes, despite the fact that 99% of the players think them weak or even useless.

    Avatar photoSuperCaffeineDude

    5- I agree mid game items tend to be used and then gone quite quickly, I loot that gear from my foes, ally a village with good stock, and sell items to get high-end stuff way-before my enemies roll out with similar gear. Which is a shame as I like the idea of motley archers and rusty mailed melee troops, but value of veteran troops exceed the costs of quality armour, especially with high recruitment costs. To keep mid-game going I’d need to maintain a numerical advantage for longer, get better men for my money, have men quit of their own accord, fight weaker less profitable enemies.

    6-8- I definitely think that two handed weapons are powerful enough, especially if you count billhooks. Against goblins shields are much more valuable due to their reliance on ranged attacks, so I’ll forgo 2 handers in that case, but against orks, you really need a shielded frontline with crossbow support able to transition to the billhook (to keep your glass cannons out of range). Against the undead(++), plebs and wolfmen, it’s good to have two well armoured guys dealing sweeping AOE to the sides of your shielded front or pike&ranged middle.

    However with that said I do think that there needs to be a parry system (which there isn’t ?I think?), where if the shield isn’t present the weapon becomes the primary means of defence of which some weapons are better than others.

    I would suggest that first the defender simply try to avoid the blow using dodge…
    Should that fail the chance of blocking a blow should be: Melee Defence = Melee Defence + (Melee Weapon Defence -Incoming Weapon Evasion)
    Should that succeed the blow is blocked and damage is inflicted to the defenders weapon: Inflicted Damage = Inflicted Damage / ((dodge/x)+(Melee Defence/y))

    -X Overall I agree with most of what you’re suggesting, BB is by large one of my favorite games at the moment, each update has had me very excited.

    Avatar photoWargasm

    2-hander weapons can certainly be effective in the right context. I bought a sellsword with good all-round attack and defence skills and 3-4 ready-made level-ups. So I immediately gave him utility perks so that he could wear lots of heavy armour and carry lots of weapons in reserve, and then started making him more destructive with offensive perks. Now, at level 11 with no defensive perks, his melee and ranged skill are both c. 75 and his melee and ranged defence are both c. 25. I often just throw him right into the middle of the melee. He might receive a few scratches, but then he (aided by Bloody Harvest and perhaps some shield-smashing from comrades) performs a vicious swing with a greatsword or 2-handed hammer, which is bound to kill or severely wound at least one of those bastards. Then he still has 3 action points and can quick-handedly take out a Spiked Impaler that only costs 2 action points to fire. His offensive perks include both Close-Combat Archer (+50% damage with ranged weapons from 1-2 tiles at any time) and Killing Frenzy (+50% damage with any weapon after a kill), which means that this initial shot is either going to do (at least) 200% of normal damage or is going to kill someone off so that he’ll be able to do at least 200% damage on his next turn. And he still has another couple of impalers hidden in his pockets …

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