Topic: Are fights scaling to company size properly?

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  • 13. December 2016 at 20:10 #18251
    Avatar photoIgniferroque
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    So I bought a treasure map for a few thousand gold. Several weeks later I eventually gear up to go get it. When I got there, I found this:

    Twenty-seven enemies most of whom can be revived by the Necromancers in the back. This is the force opposing my company of 2500 (Great!) renown who’s highest member is level 7. The average of the troops I’m bringing to the fight is between 3 and 4 while the average level including my reserves is between level 2 and 3.

    It is difficult for me to imagine what treasure they might hold that would still be significant to me if I had the gear and skill to beat them in the first place. Unless you’ve introduced area effect weapons that I just haven’t found yet, I’m inclined to think the difficulty is tuned a little high.

    I did, however, think of a possible explanation. During that campaign I got into the habit of carrying a full roster of 18 people. I wanted to be able to have people on hand to give the injured a chance to rest. Is it possible that the game is scaling fights your company size instead of just the 12 people you’re able to bring? I just started a new campaign after hitting a wall and noticed the fight scales down the number of enemies if you can’t field a full 12 people. If this code hadn’t been touched since you increased the company size to 18, it could be making the fights harder than intended.

    In any case, you’ll need a tuning pass at some point at least for the Veteran difficulty. Or consider changing the difficulty name “Beginner” to “Normal.” Because at 300 hours played according to Steam with at least 50 on this build, I don’t think I’m considered a beginner anymore.

    15. December 2016 at 03:38 #18257
    Avatar photoDanubian
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    Ok. Lets get some things straight here.

    There are fixed locations on the map and there are quest spawned / faction spawned locations.

    The fixed locations are places that are guarded by toughest enemies regardless of what level you are. I also think they may get different sizes depending on your stats later on (i cant be 100% sure but i think ive had locations that displayed different amounts and compositions of troops at different times i visited them, i believe some of them spawn parties that roam around).

    The spawned locations, and in particular the quest spawned locations, will, depending on different factors, be scaled to your power. Naturally the missions that spawn them will also have different amounts of skulls, so if you have 6 men party, you wont be sent to kill 14 raiders, in a 1 skull mission at least.

    So when it comes to the particular location you ran into, its not one that you are supposed to kill that early on. It will not scale down to your size, you are basically wasting time there. You should not be wandering off road until you have at the very least 12 men party that are at the very least ~ level 6. What you should be doing is roaming from town to town and picking up easy quests that net 1000-2000 gold.

    For example my current level 11 party that is customized to kill Orc Warriors would smash through that location probably without anyone even being hit (archery is useless on skeletons, they have like 95% immunity to it, so the trick is to have 12 melees and attack during the night so their archers are useless; since each one my 12 melees can kill multiple skelies in a 1 v 1 its like hot knife through butter, although you have to prioritize the skelies with 2 handed weapons (and 2 tiles reach weapons), those can be nasty).

    15. December 2016 at 09:14 #18262
    Avatar photoRusBear
    Participant

    First, I have to disappoint you a little bit : the skeletons – archers do not have penalties for shooting at night ), so that the latest intensification of necromancers in the patch has made such a site probably second difficulty after 12 Orc Warrior with Lord). Well, it is the lyrics.
    Now about question. Exactly one factor( there is some more but this one – 100%) on which depend all the battle – it is game day of the company – the farther away the enemies will be more, regardless of the difficulty level, your party size or the fame.

    15. December 2016 at 13:56 #18269
    Avatar photoDanubian
    Participant
    RusBear wrote:

    First, I have to disappoint you a little bit : the skeletons – archers do not have penalties for shooting at night ), so that the latest intensification of necromancers in the patch has made such a site probably second difficulty after 12 Orc Warrior with Lord). Well, it is the lyrics.
    Now about question. Exactly one factor( there is some more but this one – 100%) on which depend all the battle – it is game day of the company – the farther away the enemies will be more, regardless of the difficulty level, your party size or the fame.

    Surely there are some limits to this? Like im not literally seeing bigger and bigger skeleton sites i think.

    Didnt know about skele archers, thats useful info.

    17. December 2016 at 22:37 #18316
    Avatar photoNamespace
    Participant

    Contracts like this, spawned from a map are very hard usually. They do actually have pretty good loot though. I can imagine there would be 5k-10k crowns to be had there depending on how fast you can mow them down and sell their weapons. Also I feel these locations often have uniques. In your case, I would cancel and come back when my company hit lv11 and you got at least 2 heavy troopers (wielding 2-handed weapons).
    To be honest, this is probably a mid-tier enemy. But they can still really wreck you at lv7. High tier undead locations is all of that and on top a few vampires and lost souls.

    To obliterate this specific enemy composition I would want to have at least 2 archers with 80+ ranged skill to take out the necromancers in rounds 2-5, at the very least 2 soldiers with 200+ armor and greatswords or warbrands to kill the bulk of the skeletons in rounds 1-5 with AOE attacks (they absolutely need reach advantage and 30+ melee def. otherwise they will get killed very fast). The enemy damage comes from skeleton guards who wield 2handed weapons like polearms, greatswords, greataxes. You can use archers to whittle down their armor – usually after you killed the necromancers. Engage those with shieldbearers (at least 150 armor), if possible burst them down in one round before they can attack you.
    All of this requires at least 12 people, archers and heavies lv6+.
    The very first round you must charge the enemy and not wait until they reach you. Archers (in the 2nd row) need to advance 1 tile to hit the necromancers with their aimed shot, 2 for a quick shot.
    Careful if you engage their archers in melee combat, since they wield daggers and can possibly kill your heavy armored guys if they dont have good melee defense and attack.

    Skeletons are highly resistant to arrows (hp dmg) and, i believe spears also. My shieldbros would usually wear swords or warhammers at this stage.

    12 experienced soldiers would absolutely crush this army. I suggest you come back later and go on a rampage :)

    18. December 2016 at 00:10 #18321
    Avatar photoWargasm
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    Namespace wrote:

    2 soldiers with 200+ armor and greatswords or warbrands to kill the bulk of the skeletons in rounds 1-5 with AOE attacks (they absolutely need reach advantage and 30+ melee def. otherwise they will get killed very fast)

    I’ve seen mercs with ~300 head and body armour (and the Battle Forged perk) and very high melee skill (and the Berserk perk), plus high hit points and resolve in case of hits, scythe through skeleton hordes with only a few scratches despite having barely any melee defence.

    18. December 2016 at 03:03 #18322
    Avatar photoDanubian
    Participant

    I dont even bother with shooting at necromancers, just destroy everything in my path full melee. So they raise 2 skelies per turn? Meh, so what :D

    19. December 2016 at 20:36 #18336
    Avatar photoNamespace
    Participant
    Wargasm wrote:

    I’ve seen mercs with ~300 head and body armour (and the Battle Forged perk) and very high melee skill (and the Berserk perk), plus high hit points and resolve in case of hits, scythe through skeleton hordes with only a few scratches despite having barely any melee defence.

    I was trying to explain a fairly cheap setup that would work. 300+ armor with battle forged would work too as long as you do not take too many hits, especially from guards. I still think reach advantage is the most essential perk for any 2hander build. My best soldiers can get to 100-120 melee defense with reach advantage stacks.

    20. December 2016 at 08:09 #18341
    Avatar photoWargasm
    Participant
    Namespace wrote:

    I was trying to explain a fairly cheap setup that would work. 300+ armor with battle forged would work too as long as you do not take too many hits, especially from guards. I still think reach advantage is the most essential perk for any 2hander build. My best soldiers can get to 100-120 melee defense with reach advantage stacks.

    Certainly it would be silly not to pick it if you’ve already got a berserker with very high melee defence. But mine was a wildman with crap defence skills but 3-star melee talent and masses of hit-points, fatigue and resolve, and some magical body-armour providing close to 400 protection, as well as a shielded supporting caste to occupy the guards.

    I had another wildman whose head+body armour value was close to 800, so that the Battle Forged bonus was close to 40% and it was equivalent to having over 1000 armour (just as well, since his defence skills were both negative for much of his career). With that kind of protection, you need to get hit many times with large weapons before your hit points are threatened. So, provided melee skill and max fatigue are high, anything that’s close enough is likely to be devastated before you’re in any real trouble.

    20. December 2016 at 19:46 #18344
    Avatar photoWargasm
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    Here’s what you want to see from a newly recruited wildman: high melee skill with two-star talent, and talent for melee defence; high hit-points and talent for them and even an Iron Jaw for extra security; max fatigue already high enough that no talent is needed; and high resolve to go with starting combat at confident morale!

    Wildman with excellent starting attributes

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    1. Head-Start.jpg

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