Topic: Training Hall is extremely underwhelming

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  • 8. March 2017 at 23:33 #20198
    Avatar photoMike
    Participant

    So after much anticipation we get a temporary “Student” in exchange for cash.

    Really?

    If my own bros can randomly train each other while on the road, why can’t the “experienced fighters” do the same in a facility designed just for the purpose (and don’t say it’s unbalanced as it’d be a child’s play to reasonably restrict access to it)?
    If I get a temporary bonus from sparring, why it’s not something related to the training, like better reflexes or improved self-confidence?

    And let’s get straight to the elephant in the room, why can’t we train brothers to gain levels? I’m not saying “pay X gold to instantly reach level 11”, but it’d make PERFECT sense to leave a greenhorn farmhand in the hall for a couple days and get back to find him understanding a thing or two about fighting. I’ll pay. And I’ll wait.

    Lock it behind high price, high renown, high faction relations or even special quests but for crying out loud, give me another way to beat fresh recruits into shape other than hiding them away way behind the frontline because while most of the company are hardcore veterans the most newbies can hope to achieve during a first dozen battles is not to die instantly from a random swing.

    8. March 2017 at 23:44 #20201
    Avatar photoNamespace
    Participant

    My thoughts exactly. The vet. hall is very disappointing imo. I’m not even talking about balancing or cost here but what it does is underwhelming to say the least.

    As for training new recruits. I would say, give them a polearm and put them in the backline, but we all know how bandit marksmen like to kill them.
    I used to take only a few guys to easy battles like ghouls and direwolves but now.. if the enemy has 4 large ghouls and they can just swallow up a brother for no reason, taking less than 12 guys seems kind of suicidal. Same for direwolves with overwhelm now.

    9. March 2017 at 07:15 #20211
    Avatar photoIoci
    Participant

    i never use them.

    i would like to see a training hall that could allow the brother have a chance to gain a good trait or remove a bad one. exp boost is nice, but it should be a rather basic function, and its somehow expensive in the early & mid game.

    or even remove the weapon expertise from perk system, and add them as a trait, then those sword masters will really master the swords from the beginning because they could always have that trait when you recruit them.

    or even gives a very low chance to gift the brother who trained there an extra perk point.

    all these changes would make the training hall alive.

    9. March 2017 at 07:51 #20212
    Avatar photonope100500
    Participant

    I do use training hall, when I have cash to throw away. But yes, it’s extremely underwhelming.
    Even choice between exp boost options is kind of trivial.
    +40% for 2-3 days = total average 100% boost in days*exp. Makes sense on short trips.
    +30% for 4-6 days = 150% default pick.
    +20% for 6-8 days = 140% BAD option, never use this.

    9. March 2017 at 09:30 #20214
    Avatar photoRusBear
    Participant

    veteran hall — unsatisfactory.
    Of course, selling levels – is nonsense. Pay and win! Let’s at least not in this game, okay?
    However, the function of the VH looks very weak. So long waiting and receiving sadness. Even I would have been able to offer a few simple things.
    1. Training a certain skill (not immediately but + to the maximum roll per level)
    2. Temporary trait (strong, healthy, agile) with some chance of +1 to the target statistic after its removal.
    3. Special trainig for veterans with permanent injuries in the possibility of some reduction of negative consequences.
    and much more…
    Eh

    9. March 2017 at 13:55 #20231
    Avatar photoMike
    Participant
    RusBear wrote:

    Of course, selling levels – is nonsense. Pay and win!

    Not to be rude, but I don’t think you paid much attention. Allow me to reiterate: I don’t ask to be able to instantly level brothers to the max using training hall. I want to be able to train low-level brothers a bit, say to level 4-5, after I both have to pay and wait some time before they are done training.

    We are already able to hire people with a couple of ready-trained levels, and the cost to do so is proportionately higher than the same recruit (with the same equipment) at lvl 1. So we’re basically paying for their previous training. How would be the training hall any different in this regard? And in any way, money doesn’t exactly rain on you in this game, so even if it was like you said you’d still have to earn that coins first somewhere. And there are no gambling halls around AFAIK.

    It’s a feature that’d be most useful in mid- and late-game, as by that time you’ve probably already got both equipment and spare funds, but as you’re consistently facing stronger and more numerous opponents you’re bound to take some losses. Losses that are hard to replace because the raw recruits are barely able to carry hi-quality equipment, let alone fight enemies effectively.

    So at that point if you lose a brother his replacement is stuck in the second line cowering behind the kite shield until he can gather enough collateral exp to be able to somehow contribute to a fight. Until then – he’s a dead weight. And you are HIGHLY unlikely to recruit someone who has at the same time desirable backround, satisfactory stats/traits AND a couple levels ready to be spent.

    9. March 2017 at 14:42 #20234
    Avatar photoWargasm
    Participant
    RusBear wrote:

    1. Training a certain skill (not immediately but + to the maximum roll per level)
    2. Temporary trait (strong, healthy, agile) with some chance of +1 to the target statistic after its removal.
    3. Special trainig for veterans with permanent injuries in the possibility of some reduction of negative consequences.

    I like these ideas.

    If you could pay higher amounts of money to have recruits reach higher levels eventually, how would that differ (much) from just paying more money to recruit a sellsword who is already at level 4-5? Would it just be a somewhat cheaper but more delayed way of achieving the same thing for a background that never comes with ready experience? Not that I’d entirely dislike that, since it would make more backgrounds more useable later into the game …

    However, I prefer the process of gradually building recruits up, one level at a time, via battles. I’d like it to be quicker, but I still want it to be step-by-step. It’s just a shame there aren’t more enemies later in the game that are suitable for “farming” experience for raw recruits …

    14. March 2017 at 13:19 #20490
    Avatar photoMike
    Participant
    Wargasm wrote:

    there aren’t more enemies later in the game that are suitable for “farming” experience for raw recruits …

    That’s precisely the problem, later on the game world gets harder and the company has no option of picking fights with weaker opponents, they all get stronger and/or more numerous!

    Even if the new recruits could do some damage there is still the problem with AI focusing on the weakest unit whenever possible, so you have little choice but to make them an immobile tin can stuck in the back line. I say: boring!

    Another option would be to simply give ALL the recruits some levels as the game progresses. Easier to do for sure, would make little sense fluff-wise but at this point I’d gladly take any solution other than the current grind.

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