Topic: First feedbacks after last update (new skills and injuries)

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  • #16928
    Datom
    Participant

    I love the latest update! Since I enjoy the simulation of a living, realistic fantasy world very much, the update added something i missed before and feels one step closer to becoming the masterpiece it deserves to be.

    I had only trouble with one peticular thing: since wounds can have a devistating effect in form of infection or (of course) on the performance in battle, it’s very annoying to have sometimes, depending on the world you generated, absolutely no way to treat the wounds, since in some areas of the map towns just didn’t generate chapels. This makes descending deep “into the wild” far away from towns practically impossible, as long as there is no way to treat the wounds for yourself. When i signed for a caravan contract across the whole map, i got attacked not far from the start, where my brothers got injured and thus was forced to watch the caravan pass multiple settlements, while my brothers developed infections one after another.

    Please add some kind of healing backgrounds, making it possible to use herbs or even events sometimes to treat the wounds of the brothers. Not instantly as this would be OP in my opinion, but like it taking some time, maybe even triggering an event depending on what kind of injury is treated, and maybe just as long as you are camping. Since it just doesn’t feel good to have like a monk for healing at level 1 with your veteran level 11 team, you could later maybe even add a system for healers to level up by treating wounds, making it less likely to fail, possible to reduce the negative effects a little and so on. This would help give more use to the new roster system and would go well with other support classes, maybe having a little impact in battle like a small resolve boost, knowing you got a skilled medic to save your limbs and lives after battle.

    I hope i could give you useful feedback and/or inspiration, of course you could solve the problems i pointed out otherwise. Please make it possible to access the settlements you pass through with your caravan aswell, i was missing this even before the update. I mean, they are passing right through it, why shouldn’t i be able to quickly sell my treasures at the biggest city on the map, treat the wounds of a battle before or take a beer on the go? ^^
    Thank you for making this game!

    #16929
    MrCrim
    Participant

    I wish they had the shield bash perk that made it do damage. Really miss that perk..

    #16931
    Wargasm
    Participant

    I wish they had the shield bash perk that made it do damage. Really miss that perk..

    It ought to be included in the new version of Shield Expert, and the same perk ought to reduce all shield-related skills by 25%, like the weapon mastery perks. The perk should basically be Shield Mastery.

    #16947
    RusBear
    Participant

    Interesting fact №3 :

    Fisherman/farmer/ lumberjack with 3 stars talent in range def can get only +3 on level up
    Sellsword with 3 stars get + 4

    #16974
    Mike
    Participant

    I very much enjoy the update, mostly the banishment of numerous ridiculously OP shenanigans (“machinegun-bows”, I’m looking at you).
    “Freeing” the perks from trees was a great decision, I love the newly-acquired flexibility in tailoring each brother to his role.
    While I’m all for the new injury system I think it needs some deeper development – right now it feels quite random and easy (new “Hold out”) to circumvent on the part of company.
    “Special” equipment is sadly random too, with numerous examples given for how it can flop in a hilariously spectacular way.
    That beeing said, going in good direction!

    EDIT:

    i think chance of hitting by bow and crossbow in the back of team- brother should be at least lower than the enemy…

    Why so? If we assume the melee is dynamic, it’s quite impossible to predict where each combatant will be when the shot lands. If we assume the static formation is kept, your men are actually shielding the enemy from the archer standing behind their backs. Either manouver your men to give them a clear line of sight or aim at people further back. Or switch to melee weapons.
    There’s a good reason why aside from hollywood stunts nobody in their right mind tries to shoot into hand-to-hand involving their own, even with modern firearms which are infinitely more acuurate than a bow or x-bow.

    – While you have a “support” item on your guy (such as bandage or antidote) […] I think it could be nice if this kind of ability would always come at last

    +1
    Speaking of support items, I think there should be at least 2 slots for them. We can lug up to 4 halberds on our back – and equip them instantly, no less – but cannot keep both a bandage and antidote vial on our belt? Plain silly… Make it require a perk if you have to (would make sense to include it into “bags and belts” IMO) but add more slots.

    #16977
    spamtaboo
    Participant

    Hello Guys!

    First of let me join a warm wave of cheering and congratulate you on yet another huge step in this game. It feels amazing. I am already on turn 101 and the game is still very interesting. You did an amazing job and created a beautiful game with tremendous potential for replay-ability. Now to the point:

    1. I will join guys requesting info about injury when you hover over the enemy’s injury pic.
    2. I have encountered an odd behaviour with the Knee Cap injury. First of I am pretty sure I healed it in the temple and yet it still showed 3-5 days to heal. Second on the first turn of the battlebrother who used to have it, I still got an extra stamina spent after that it was fine.
    3. Not all weapon skills are present, i.e. no specialization for 1h swords. It would be great to add spec for orc chain, etc.

    P.S.
    I got the company of hardened brothers (8th lvl) and decided to take three sculls contract on greenskins. Only half of the men survived. The game is as challenging as ever, loving every moment of it.

    #16979
    spamtaboo
    Participant

    Oh yes, and bandages, no longer needed. I do not buy them at all. I assume you intended quite an opposite (increasing the stack)

    #16982
    RusBear
    Participant

    Why so?…

    because… read the discussion further. Discontent caused not the fact of getting team shot in the back in a straight line – it is ok, “realistic”, even good, but what with the shooting at a diagonal trajectory from 6 hexes “to miss” Archers now with a 90% chance to get a single hex where is your brother. That is bad.

    #17112
    Hanekem
    Participant

    My one concern is that a couple of the injuries cause a % decrease on damage dealt, that is reasonable for most weapons, with the exception of the Crossbows. the effect of those wounds there would be to increase the AP cost for reloading (since it is where strength is applied with that weapon)
    I know making a unique rule for one weapon type could be annoying codewise but it bugs me, and wanted to bring this to attention

    #17113
    Rap
    Keymaster

    Speaking of support items, I think there should be at least 2 slots for them. We can lug up to 4 halberds on our back – and equip them instantly, no less – but cannot keep both a bandage and antidote vial on our belt? Plain silly… Make it require a perk if you have to (would make sense to include it into “bags and belts” IMO) but add more slots.

    All of the accessories, except for wardogs for obvious reasons, can be put into the bag slots.

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    #17129
    RusBear
    Participant

    if enemy has at least a 1 ( one) point of armor the damage for HP is calculated from : “ignor armor” range, is it so?
    is this a reason why rare 2 hand axe make 20 damage for thug with 40 armor?

    #17196
    le_souriceau
    Participant

    I generaly liked new update, but some points. Mostly about weapon balance.

    1) After introduction of warbow (and changed point-blank mechanics) crossbows more or less useless, especially on later stages of game, when you have decent marksmen and must hit fast/far/hard to survive. Bow speciality perk gives warbow immense advantage over crossbow to push things more.

    2) Same thing – I myself found swords inferior to other melee choices for specialist. Yes, they have their pros and can be used for some fancy agility build (not my thing), but… Most of end-game challenges leaves them lacking in so needed power.

    3) New long axe is generaly FAR more usefull choice for 2d line (SPLIT SHIELDS!) over billhook with it sitiational pull ability. This comes to extent where billhook is almost irrevelent weapon.

    For me main pain/horror/imbalance of the game – large orc warbands (with lot of warriors/warchief). In order to defeat them somewhat reliably you must abandon most of variety and fun in warband-building – use very strict perk configuration, practise “recruit eugenics”, savescamming and heavy calculated abuse of game mechanics and AI.

    Every time when I trying play with fun, diversed and more or less random band of average joes, they simply farking annihilated by orcs. But boring “powerplay”, munchkins band have some success. This is sad. My be I just bad commander :/

    #17197
    Wargasm
    Participant

    I generaly liked new update, but some points. Mostly about weapon balance.

    1) After introduction of warbow (and changed point-blank mechanics) crossbows more or less useless, especially on later stages of game, when you have decent marksmen and must hit fast/far/hard to survive. Bow speciality perk gives warbow immense advantage over crossbow to push things more.

    2) Same thing – I myself found swords inferior to other melee choices for specialist. Yes, they have their pros and can be used for some fancy agility build (not my thing), but… Most of end-game challenges leaves them lacking in so needed power.

    3) New long axe is generaly FAR more usefull choice for 2d line (SPLIT SHIELDS!) over billhook with it sitiational pull ability. This comes to extent where billhook is almost irrevelent weapon.

    For me main pain/horror/imbalance of the game – large orc warbands (with lot of warriors/warchief). In order to defeat them somewhat reliably you must abandon most of variety and fun in warband-building – use very strict perk configuration, practise “recruit eugenics”, savescamming and heavy calculated abuse of game mechanics and AI.

    Every time when I trying play with fun, diversed and more or less random band of average joes, they simply farking annihilated by orcs. But boring “powerplay”, munchkins band have some success. This is sad. My be I just bad commander :/

    1) Crossbows are still more devastating at damaging well-armoured opponents, but now it’s hard to continue doing this without remaining in a vulnerable position; now, therefore, I tend to have crossbowmen who are also well-armoured 2-handed melee fighters, and/or who use the Footwork perk to withdraw from the throng after an initial charge, and/or who use the new Adrenaline perk to get first shot at their opponents after moving into position. Sometimes I now use throwing weapons instead of crossbows, just because these seem like a more realistic weapon for an also-melee-fighter to have. I’ve certainly been making more use than before of archers, which is pleasing to me, since I like bows and archery.

    2) I kind of agree in regard to standard swords, but rare named swords with over 100% effectiveness against armour make me want to change my mind and allow my melee mass to keep slashing away with a fatigue cost of only 16 per round, so that they can wear as much heavy armour as they like and carry a massive shield and an equally massive back-up while hardly ever being in danger of exhaustion.

    3) 101% agreed. I love longaxes and I’ve never been big on billhooks (since, e.g., their pull-in skill takes away the advantage of being able to attack an opponent who can’t attack you).

    4) I also agree about orc bands with many warriors/warlords forcing you to use a particular strategy (i.e. Battle Forged, lots of rare/named heavy armour, and weapon speciality for hammers and axes) and making it unfeasible to use more experimental builds. One of my campaigns has mostly high-level mercenaries all in brown leather/gambesons but with over 100 hit-points and around 75 resolve, and they fought a bunch of orc warriors and sort of won (the remaining 4 orcs moved off to the edges of the battlefield despite being at confident morale) but half of the 12 were killed and the band needed to be rebuilt. Basically, it’s inevitable that orc warriors/warlords will be able to smash your shields and use knock back to take higher ground and surround you; so, unless you have lots of heavy armour, you will receive devastating damage when you’re hit (which will happen eventually, despite their amazing capacity for repeated misses against surrounded, unshielded opponents at a height disadvantage) and you won’t be able to go the distance.

    #17198
    le_souriceau
    Participant

    Well, I agree, сrossbows still have bonus against armor but… if there is too many situations where this is so critical? Even very presice crossbow fire unlikely to win a day in battle against big group of heavy orcs (against unarmored ones bows is better). With goblins its better have bows (its possible outshoot them with good marksmen). With wolfs and ghouls too. With zombies may be crossbow little better, but they are not too big problem anyway. In cases with necromancer its way batter have bows (he can be shoot very fast from afar). With regular bandits its way nicer to pick their skirmishers with bows. Crossbows can be good against some heavy humans, but ocasion is rather rare and there are shields anyway.

    May be its good idea to have your shooters have BOTH perks for bow and crossbow and 2 packs of equipment for any situation in storage. But anyway with bows now you have only rare and situational drawbacks, with crossbow lack of distance is always here.

    Also there is goblin crossbow. Interesting if mass-armed. Buts its kind of wierd (and rather hard) to farm it.

    Unique weapons are good in all classes, but I think getting them is more luck and flavor then something to tie up your builds in “regular game”. Is more like fun “post-end-game” collector experience or something.

    One day beaten by orcs I become to think about some kind of macedonian/swiss answer : ) spears and pike formation with agility defence/adrenalin focus for dps. But is hard to get. Good base stats (more likely swordmasters needed) and tonns of patience to level them up in optimal way.

    #17200
    Wargasm
    Participant

    In one of my last campaigns before the perk/injury updates, I’d managed to loot so many rare/named swords and shields that everyone in the company had one, and sometimes another in reserve. With that level of availability, it did seem feasible to base a strategy around those items. Still, I haven’t seen them as much since the updates, so we’ll see.

    Personally, I’ve been finding crossbows and longbows both highly useful against all enemies except orcs and undead. I find crossbows better against direwolves, since there’s always a chance that they’ll engage you before you can fire, and then you can still shoot a bolt before taking out a melee weapon. But, generally, against most enemies, longbows are more useful than they were before, and the crossbowmen tend to be more vulnerable after moving forwards, since they no longer have another couple of loaded bows in their pockets to punish anyone who engages them in melee.

    Against orcs, I think you can’t beat having everyone in the heaviest armour available and armed either with hammer/axe and shield or having super-high melee skill and going nuts with AofE attacks with a 2-hander. The new Adrenaline perk is good for avoiding getting stunned and for drawing first blood. Previously, it was difficult for someone with a greataxe or greatsword to move into prime position without getting stunned before having a chance to inflict damage. If everyone in the band has Adrenaline, you can wait turn and then position everyone ideally for an en mass assault at the start of the next round. This is especially good combined with the new Backstabber perk.

    The only trouble is: I want it to be possible to beat all enemies, including orc warriors/warlords, just through skill and tactical cunning. I don’t want it to depend on putting on a massive suit of armour.

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