Topic: Suggestion: Student Buff

  • Author
    Posts
  • #3778
    NewAgeOfPower
    Participant

    Awhile back, Sky did a writeup on perks. Both him and many others all claimed “Student is perfectly balanced!”

    Not a single one of my party members uses it – and I have a 12 max level char party. In fact, using it is completely suboptimal.

    Theres little reason to pick it right now. Getting to the next level 20% faster is meaningless on both my Short Term party members (peasants) and my Long Term brothers (professionals)

    On a mass peasant builds, you want to take shield/other defensive bonuses, so they can survive long enough to swarm the enemy and not cause a mass-fleeing event when they get facerolled, and offensive bonuses so they can actually swarm their opponents.

    On long term members, they will get sufficient exp from surviving and doing stuff, plus, you are almost always planning for a max level build, where each perk point is carefully considered.

    My solution:

    Allow student to give a small, jack-of-all trades bonus. +1 stat to all core levelup stats (Health, Fatigue, Initiative, Resolve, Ranged & Melee Weapons skills, Ranged & Melee Defense skills) every time you level up.

    Basically, sacrifice a perk point that would give you a highly focused set of bonuses (like being able to wear super heavy armor or a huge boost to armor durability, etc) into a generalist bonus; 9 extra Fatigue at level 11 is far less fatigue than save-scum rerolling levelup points would get you, but combine that with 9 extra HP, 9 extra resolve, initiative, and then its actually a useful (but not overbearing) bonus!

    #3780
    GOD
    Participant

    The agreement was that while the amount of experience the perk gives is balanced, the perk itself is rarely useful. It’s an ability that’s currently more useful as a trait than as a perk, unless they plan to introduce factors that influence the levels of mercs (level drain?).

    Changing the perk to increasing stats at level up would keep the same problem as with Student though, in that its usefulness would still be strictly level dependent. You’d only want to pick it at level 1, because every level higher than that its effect diminishes, eventually becoming completely useless. Right now, Student is the only perk that can end up having no effect. I’d rather see that changed than having it be replaced with a perk that has the same problem.

    #3786
    Sky
    Participant

    There is a nice use to it, with the very start of the game to get your band up fast. In midgame upon losing someone you don’t need to take it since you already have a leveled core. Now surely it would be better as a trait, especially since there are already traits that give 5-10% exp bonus making the difference not that big. But the fact that they do stack makes it even more valuable. A 30% exp boost is like having a level more every 3rd lvl.

    As I already said it is an early game perk, and as such it is useful. And as I already wrote midgame and endgame it’s almost non existent. Now especially on hard the start is obviously the hardest and easiest way to power up is by fast leveling. Now since you do not have that much money and need to spend more for buying stuff, makes your party more vulnerable and you can not balance the odds with equipment. The other early game advantage you get is a faster growing captain class guy who gets the utility tree, or even two to have both t3 perks. The faster you get it the easier it will be. Now stacking it with a trait bonus makes you max out utility as fast as leveling ~4,5lvl without the combo. Instead of 6 lvls it might not sound much but thats a healthy difference on a hard mode game with a nice big spread out map.

    Just for the record it still is only an early game skill. And it sure could be improved to last thru mid and maybe even endgame. The question is, does it need to? As it is now I do find it balanced, and I did test it to see the difference with my testing party. It is a t1 perk afterall. Your suggestion is a good one but it would only strenghten it’s importance early game maybe even make it too strong. +10 to every stat at lvl 11 is quite effective. It would make it more valid perk, but only at level one and make it more discouraging at higher levels…

    #3826
    NewAgeOfPower
    Participant

    I’d rather see that changed than having it be replaced with a perk that has the same problem.

    It’s not the same problem. Right now, people refuse to pick Student on the vast majority of their characters.

    The proposed solution would be a huge inducement to picking student at lvl 1, and a lesser inducement as the character leveled though. However, given the EXP bonus, the (few) people who would take Student already do it at level 1 or 2 anyways.

    Also, is Sky your less coherent sockpuppet?

    #3827
    Sky
    Participant
    #3828
    Trig
    Participant

    There is already a character trait for smart guys that allows faster exp gaining. I see absolutely noneed to have it as a perk as well. Only picked it a few times on my first playthrough and never since.

    #3829
    Malthus
    Participant

    Why not simply give that perk “+1 for all stats for every levelup the char has” and not only at levelup so it would be dynamic AND you would not have to pick it up on the first level up, if you don´t want to at this point. This way the perk would always scale and still usefull if picked up later

    "I am a Paladin!"
    >OMG, Malthus, there are no damn paladins in Battle Brothers...<
    "OK, OK! Then I´m a wrecked down minstrel drunkard pretending to be a paladin, singing so wrong in the midst of battle that even the undead run in fear... Better?!"

    #3830
    GOD
    Participant

    I actually misread your suggestion and thought you meant adding a +1 to every stat you level up – meaning a maximum of +30 at level 11 if picked as your first perk. A +1 to every stat seem too much, though. However, I’d recommend avoiding stat increases as perks eiher way, as that seems more like the terrain of traits. Colossus is an exception to this because it is percentage based and a way of having picking HP actually be viable. With this change, the same Colossus perk would also become strictly inferior to Student in almost every situation, rather than being viable in a different way.

    #3848
    Malthus
    Participant

    It would mean +10 to everything on full level instead of another useful perk. Seems like an ok trade to me. You could aswell make a +5 to all and let it give a +1 to half of the stats every two levelups and +1 on the other half in the level ups between. So it would not be an impact as big as the first version. + It would synergize with colossus. more hp * 1,25 > less hp * 1,25

    "I am a Paladin!"
    >OMG, Malthus, there are no damn paladins in Battle Brothers...<
    "OK, OK! Then I´m a wrecked down minstrel drunkard pretending to be a paladin, singing so wrong in the midst of battle that even the undead run in fear... Better?!"

    #3868
    Covered in Weasels
    Participant

    +1 to every stat on each level up may be a useful perk, but it is also uninteresting. I prefer perks that do something special rather than provide small incremental stat boosts. Student seems fine to me in its current state.

    #3917
    GOD
    Participant

    I mean as in having to choose between them. You’d only ever pick Colossus if you’re trying to build a characters with loads of HP, otherwise Student would be superior. Reducing the bonus also doesn’t solve that it’s still a plain stat bonus, which is more suited to traits. I’d rather see perks affect your playstyle in some way, while stats are reserved to traits and level up.

    #3920
    Malthus
    Participant

    Ok thats a valid point.

    "I am a Paladin!"
    >OMG, Malthus, there are no damn paladins in Battle Brothers...<
    "OK, OK! Then I´m a wrecked down minstrel drunkard pretending to be a paladin, singing so wrong in the midst of battle that even the undead run in fear... Better?!"

Viewing 12 posts - 1 through 12 (of 12 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.