Jago

[Jago]

Sweet job! :)
So, these are the lower tier weapons for the morning-star, two-handed axe and two-handed sword? Good ideas you’ve got there!

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[Jago]

There will be no plate armor in the game, unless through modding. That’s because, the medieval-themed setting somewhat reflects the time period of 1100-1300A.D.

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[Jago]

66 hours so far.
To be honest, since the announcement of Fallout 4 I’ve been busy replaying Fallout: New Vegas… :P

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[Jago]

An entertaining read! :D

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[Jago]

All these weapons could be added, but they must serve some purpose, gameplay-wise. Most of the polearms above are very similar to what we already have in the game and would have very similar stats and skills. So why add them? Unless we can come up with a unique trait for each weapon, it will be all the same, just with different looks.

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[Jago]

Wolves wrote:

Yes, you gain statspoint gain is random on levelup. Rep said they will change that.

When and where? Just curious.

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[Jago]

ManaSeed wrote:

>> These fights won’t be over in 80 seconds, but 10-15 minutes for a medium sized battle (12-12) with good armor on both sides sounds realistic. The largest battles would probably take 30 minutes at most, including hunting down routing units (i.e. finding that last archer).
This is EXACTLY what I think. That’s why I keep thinking that a 10~20 minutes battle has some chance for reinforcements or enemy scouts to join battle, depending on the battle location. Even if we put aside all these random encounters about being discovered by another enemy unit amidst battle, at least the enemy base and enemy should reinforce their friend if you bash him right in front of their eyes (or visible range), where the distance is 20 minutes walk or less.

Yup, it’s already works in the game like this. Having reinforcements appear on the edge of the map, instead of starting out in the center might be implemented at some point. Similar when you are aiding a battle, that has been going on for a while, and you start a few hexes away from the front line.

ManaSeed wrote:

So I suggest to slightly modify the AI if possible, which is more viable.

GOD wrote:

I expect that we’ll see a slight change in the AI behaviour eventually so that it’ll attack with multiple groups that are individually weaker than you, but stronger combined. This could result in bases sending out troops to help, if the AI feels like it would tip the scales.

I think we can all agree on this. The AI has to become a bit smarter concerning their troop movements.

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[Jago]

GOD wrote:

That arbitrariness is just the way the system works, similar to how none of the stats increase the amount of damage you do with weapons. That’s arbitrary, as you’d expect individual strength and skill to be a huge factor, but it’s done that way so as to shift your attention towards the gear, rather than the stats. Same goes for stunning, which is part of why I’m against having stats influence the chance to stun – that should remain the territory of weapons. I’m inclined to think the same of the chance of getting stunned, since it’s not all that common and only really a factor when fighting Orcs, which is fine and something that makes them different from other factions, while still being manageable with the right preparations.

I’m not sure I understand. Do you want hitpoints NOT to influence the chance to stun, the chance to be stunned, or both? Also if we tie the chance to CAUSE stun to the weapons, wouldn’t a mere peasant have the same chance to stun as an experienced knight if the carry the same type of mace? That doesn’t seem right.

GOD wrote:

It is cause to dismiss it when there are alternatives to it or if the mechanic isn’t necessary. Hitpoints might be less dynamic than fatigue, as your chance of getting stunned would remain stable for most of the fight, but would make more sense thematically and would give a boost to the stat and Colossus perk. It would also remove the problem that undead pose for the fatigue approach, since they never get tired and thus would always get a boost regardless of how much they fight. In contrast, locked spread or not, making it fatigue based would only further cement the superiority of high fatigue characters over low fatigue ones, as for its effect to be dynamic the variation between stun chances at the different stages would have to make a noticeable difference, otherwise why bother, which would result in large differences between a high and low fatigue character. Fatigue simply does not need a buff like that, therefore I’d rather see the chance of being stunned depend on HP, if the decision is made to tie it to a stat.

Yes, sounds all very good to me.

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[Jago]

In real life where battles could last for days, the actual fighting was much shorter. It could take a few hours, including capturing fleeing men, but most of the time was spent of camping and waiting for a good time for an attack (an extreme example, the battle of Tours lasted for 7 days Battle of Tours. Also these were large scale battles with thousands and ten-thousands of soldiers on each side.

In Battle Brothers we have only little skirmishes. These fights won’t be over in 80 seconds, but 10-15 minutes for a medium sized battle (12-12) with good armor on both sides sounds realistic. The largest battles would probably take 30 minutes at most, including hunting down routing units (i.e. finding that last archer).

ManaSeed wrote:

Hmm, I’m not sure why would you say that. I thought when we’re ambushed/surrounded in forest, you know they’re coming in all directions (as opposed to the right side in usual battle), but you won’t know how many of them coming in a certain direction, unless you have spotted all of them, which takes several rounds. Well, in a forest you’ve never been before, with so many trees hindering your sight, and the terrain is rather uneven, how can you easily traverse the area and locate/attack the enemy?

Well, if you are ambushed in the forest, the enemy is probably very close, close enough for the combat to start in 1-2 turns. You could say the combat starts when your scouts notice something suspicious (shades moving between the trees) and then everyone prepares their weapons.

In other words, there’s no need to chance the game in this aspect. Reinforcements arrive if they are close by. Other enemy groups outside the battle couldn’t move much further even if the battle lasts very long. It’s working, it’s simple, leave it as it is.

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[Jago]

W-Well, that’s what the game is about, isn’t it? You are a mercenary band and try to make the world a somewhat safer place. But despite my efforts so far, if I leave village A or B for a day it gets raided again. At the moment these villages can only afford 1-2 militia so even a scout party is impossible for them.

I also noticed that there are no more caravans coming or going, but the road to these towns should be safe.

Sky wrote:

ManaSeed wrote:

Seriously? Did you stalk on them and saw a band of Orcs turning into a fortress of Orc, or something like that? I’m just curious.

It supposed to happen, tho personally I never seen it, the enemy seems to flee endlessly, but usually throught other enemy camps so following one group opens all kind of nasty things.

Me neither.

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[Jago]

GOD wrote:

My worry with this is that you run the risk of making fatigue an even more important stat than it already is.

Isn’t making the max. hitpoints reduce to chance to be stunned an option? High hitpoints could represent the resistance of a brother against status effects (stunned, posioned), thus making hitpoints a little more viable, once a medical system has be implemented. Or that’s at least how it works in many RPGs.

Anyway, having the stun chance decreased by shield and shieldwall bonus doesn’t seem enough to me. Have any stat influence the chance as well, so you can directly develop certain brothers to become more robust against stunning.

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[Jago]

GOD wrote:

What are your thoughts on the Restless Lord, by the way? I imagined that as being a regular unit, rather than a leader type (meaning there can be multiple of them in a battle).

Yeah, I overlooked that, my bad.
That’s a good idea, introducing more ghost-type monsters that are also incorporeal, tougher than the lost souls. And yes, if they can be killed in one hit (with daggers), they shouldn’t be boss types. A fitting boss type would be more something like a more powerful necromancer or something entirely else, a lich/mummy for example (you know, they usual :D ).

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[Jago]

GOD wrote:

A weapon like that gives the player a new tactical option, without lessening the ones already available.

Thanks for the example, yes it sounds very much like something I would actually try out. Hopefully the devs will eventually add this into the game.

Randomised background stats:
Like you said, as long as these variations are minor, it would work.

Deformed faction:

GOD wrote:

Now this I’m a bit uncertain of, since depending on the execution it might not gel with the atmosphere you’ve build up so far

That’s my main complaint about this idea, too. It would not really fit into the setting, at least not as a faction. I’d rather have them as monsters that you can find in caves and/or sunken/buried castles. Because as a large faction you would face them rather often and they would loose more of their unique charm every time you fight them.
They could roam long forgotten dungeons instead. When the players enters such a place, thinking “Is it Orcs? Is it the Undead?… Wait… Oh sh*t what is that?!”.
They could be demons summoned by a cultist faction. You know how demons a usually associated with flames and hellfire? Well, these are not, a unique twist.

Dodge:
I never used this trait. Well that says it all, right? ;)

Cultural transition:
That would be a really interesting addition. It’d probably difficult to implement, but once the map gets bigger there will be more room for these transitions. Maybe instead of cultural transition, villages could instead adapt to region they’re in. A village in the swamps to the east would have low houses build of stone and reed, and metal tools are rare. Villages in the mountains are build of stone, too, but are much taller and look stronger. Metal is common here, but food might be in high demand.

Robber knights:
These would be very powerful and strangle trade completely. It sounds a bit overpowered, but I like the idea.
The bandit faction could be split into two subfactions: robber knights and highwaymen.

Highwaymen are only farmers who dearly need the coin to survive the next winter. Poorly armed, like the thugs we’ve got now. Also the highwaymen faction doesn’t expand by amassing riches. Instead the number of highwaymen depends on the prosperity of the towns and villages.
Robber knights on the other side, will expand and increase their territory, just like bandits work right now. Also they’d become significant stronger then highwaymen over the time.

Bog wiedergängers:
Nice one. Not sure if it’s worth the work though, as it would be a rather situational unit. The undead usually start out in the north and don’t come down far enough to reach the swamp.

Nine Lives:
Hm, I agree that this is one perk that has to be redone. Could be very powerful though, for late-game characters with heather shields. My experienced fighters don’t get hit more than once per turn unless overwhelmed.

Wiedergänger diversity:
Well, we already discussed this! ;)
Would be a cool addition if an easy re-skinning is an option.

More pastoral elements:
A lone monastery in the mountains, priests as quest givers and the church in quarrel with the cultists. Makes me think of a “Witchfire!”-Expansion! :D
Aside from the details it adds to the setting, we’d have to think of some actual gameplay elements that involve the church.
“Blessings” like in most fantasy-rpgs is out of questions, because it’s to similar to magic, but maybe they could provide the player with information and lore from their archives?

Weapons:
There’re enough sword imo. Quarterstaff and recurved bow sound nice.

Vampire Lord:/Primal Werewolf:/Ghoul Tyrant:
You’ve probably seen them in Psens art thread. ;)
Yeah, I think they will be added sooner or later.

Internal faction differences:
Well for example the greenskins. Orcs and Goblins are not working together as some may think (only on rare occasions according to the faction text). Same could work for robber knights and highwaymen, or necromancers and vampires.
Well, that would be really complex to create and to balance. I would leave it as it is for and wait for the warring human factions first.

ManaSeed wrote:

Having 12 men as team member limit is just nice. But it would far better if we can build a camp to station our men, so we can swap members for different missions and tasks.

There will be a max. of 24 brothers you can travel with, but you can only choose up to 12 for a fight. Camping mechanics will be introduced at some point to, but it will be only a temporary, allowing you to heal brothers and repair weapons faster.

ManaSeed wrote:

When raiding enemy fortress, it would be nice to see them having palisade as outer wall, and higher ground(altitude 3) at 4 corners of the fortress as lookout tower, rather than………. just plain wilderness called Cutthroats Hideout.

#
This will be added of course. Same for dungeons, villages, orc fortresses, etc.

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[Jago]

Bravo – this must be the best suggestions-thread I’ve seen so far. Very fleshed-out and appropriate for the setting. I did not expect anything less from you. :D

Slings:
I’m not sure how a mix of hit-and-run units and the usual tanks works out.
See, I usually have a core of tanks building the frontline, not moving, letting the enemy come at me. On the back, there are 2-3 archers. Now, why would I give these archers slings? They’re covered by the guys in front of them, have better range, deal more damage, and probably don’t have to do guerrilla tactics at all.
Slings would be perfect in a completely different type of warband, where every unit has some kind of ranged weapon and is agile enough to apply hit-and-run tactics. It would be a completely different style of playing, endorsing high speed, fatigue and low AP-use. It is indeed, an interesting thought, but it would also require new balancing/redoing the perks.

I approve of this idea.

Pause:/Acquired traits:
Yes, please.

Rat-men:
Maybe they could exist as some kind of vagabond faction, a faction like the beasts, without settlements. I think having them as a large faction would give this game a to strong warhammer-vibe.

Enemy companions:
Yup.

Wetland faction:
Maybe this could be the Rat-men faction. There are probably no severs in this game, so they live in the swamps instead. Rats can swim so give them a bonus when moving across swamp,

Okay, I’ve gotta sleep. Will continue tomorrow.

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[Jago]

It probably doesn’t show the modified stat because it’s only temporary.

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