Forum Replies Created
Well I guess you’re right again about the low-magic setting. It doesn’t feel right if we have enchanted weapon being as common as normal weapons. If a weapon can be enchanted, why not all weapons? Then everything will be a mess. It doesn’t suit the atmosphere of the game without changing a lot of settings.
So…. any magic/impractical weapon is rare. And we already have small, large, short range, long range, armor breaking, flesh slashing melee weapons and ranged weapons. In addition, we can’t have weapons from different cultures. Doesn’t that mean we have almost exhausted every weapon choice to be added in our arsenal? No more new weapons?
>> I wouldn’t be surprised if Fearsome didn’t work properly for Brothers, the game IS in developement still and I’ve seen uncertain cases of other skills not always working right in some circumstances…. actually, against Orcs as well, now that I think on it.
Sorry for being misleading. Well it actually worked. Because it has low trigger rate so I made a mistake as it never triggered once in my previous experiment. In my latest experiment I found it has about 20% trigger rate (11 proc per 52 hits to armor). I can’t say it is a bad perk, but I won’t say it’s a good perk too.
If you have offensive perks and go for offensive style, it’s not easy to make an enemy flee before you kill it. Even if the enemy has 300 body armor. Unless you purposely equip a low damage weapon for this. So adding 20% chance to reduce enemy morale while damaging their armor won’t impress you or convince you to spend the hard earned perk point on Fearsome. Also, most of its alternatives (tier 2 utility perks) are better than it.
I suspect it’s the same thing even if you’re going for defensive style (about Fearsome not being useful). But I’ve never tried defensive style before….. the effects and abilities for defensive perks
are too weak….are too complicated for my intelligence to make full use of them. I don’t have courage to try any of them after I’ve read the skill description and tested them a little with my brother with 10 unspent perk points.
That actually make more(a lot of) sense and draws a clear line between real weapons and unreal weapons. Also a good move for handling background and settings.
A whip sword is cool but it usually has far less cutting power than a sword and far less reach than a whip (you also never/rarely see people using it in reality). But whip sword is not a magic weapon, as it is possible be achieved with insane weapon engineering and insane amount of practice. It’s just impractical and unreal in most situations.
However, if we allow the flaws of impractical weapons to be fixed by just a small amount of magic, we can think of it as a working model which has been successfully developed with high technology in reality. Let’s call these workable impractical weapons as Enchanted Weapons.
I wish to separate these enchanted weapons from legendary weapons, which has totally amazing powers such as healing and reviving. It’s nice if enchanted weapon is more or less on a par with real weapon (just like how protagonists using impractical weapon in games and movies, like a boss), so we can easily use all sorts of impractical/enchanted weapon together with real weapon. While legendary weapon(absolutely unbelievable weapons) is a league higher than both enchanted and normal weapon.
Regarding the term “fantasy”, rather than having more magical/legendary weapons, I mean the real weapon physics don’t have to be applied very strictly or correctly (this is a game, not to mention it involves fantasy creature), since we opt not to apply real science. This is an easy way to have more variety in weapons. We have hundreds of medieval melee weapons, but if we’re going to group them according to weapon physic and actual combat results……
In our game, the flail is said to have ability to bypass shield’s defense. In my opinion(never used a flail before), it is correct to some extent but it should actually works more like breaking the shield. But we already have several weapon skills which can break a shield, so we assign different functions to flail. That kind of logic. Half real, half fun.
Long story short. Impractical but cool weapons. Should we have them? (by using our fantasy to adjust their ability appropriately. well, we can have better chance to justify them in this fantasy world, right?)
well if orcs exist in Europe too, the world of BB must be some sort of alternative world or parallel world. I think maybe it’s good idea if weapons from different cultures exist in it too (if they are not standing out like crazy or make the existing armor looks weird). Because different things have happened in different world. Similarly, if undead can exist too, I think we won’t be crossing the line if we have slightly magical/fantasy weapon.
Also, fighting fantasy creature with real weapon by analyzing the possible result according to real history. That dilemma………
Just me though, I can accept 50% fun and 50% realism in BB’s settings.
I decided to suggest more delicate weapons for female brothers, which is yet to come.
Titan’s Sword (giant sword) > A weapon designed to fight dragons, when all other weapons have failed. Not to be mixed with greatsword (a.k.a claymore or bastard sword). Consider this weapon a variation to greatsword. It deals more dmg than greatsword, and use the same skill set without overhead strike and split shield.
Dragon’s Bane (Split) ==> costs 8AP to use, has -55% chance to hit, can hit up to 3 targets in a straight line
Ender of Forest (Swing) ==> costs 8AP to use, has -75% chance to hit, can hit up to 8 targets (using the same arc)
(Well, enemy can easily predict the movement of this long and heavy blade.)
-1 AP at start of each round, as you become less agile by carrying the big toy.
The weapon is not primarily controlled by strength of arms. It involves precise coordination between arms, waist and legs. As well as perfect timing in shifting center of mass, while utilizing almost every muscle in body.
What. You still think it is impossible? Why are you so sexist?
The user is expected to wear very minimal or no armor to offset its massive fatigue penalty. Are you happy now? Can we agree it’s a weapon for female brothers?
Yes I know have gazillion types of swords in BB. I suggest this weapon despite I realize it doesn’t add much value to weapon list as it doesn’t involve new elements, because giant swords are too cool.
Greek Fire > roman style slingshot that fires
incendiary grenadeflask with highly flammable liquid. Has range of 4 tiles. Target being hit will suffer burn status for 2 rounds. Flask will break on ground if it misses the target, and burning liquid will spread to 7 adjacent tiles. The flame lingers on ground for 2 rounds, and any units who end turn by standing on those burning tiles will take damage. It can burn bush (where units can be hid within) to ashes.
Chakram > Can be thrown in straight line up to 3 tiles for full damage, and will boomerang its way back to you if it misses the target. It will drop on ground which is right in front of unit being hit within range. You can pick it up manually or wait for it to be retrieved automatically upon victory.
Whip > particularly weak against armor and but strong against unprotected body. It greatly reduces enemy morale when enemy’s unprotected body is hit. Afterall, it has the power to bend the will of a lion.
If you accidentally hit an ally, he will be restored to full health, provided he has the trait “Masochist”. Making this the most unique weapon for female brothers.
Gauntlet > One can’t really claimed they have laid their hands on enemies until they have equipped this.
Jaw Breaker (Attack 1) ==> deal slightly higher dmg than bare fist. Has +15% chance to hit head, and has 35% chance to stun enemy when target’s head is hit.
Takedown (Attack 2) ==> deal dmg while ignore enemy armor by using joint lock technique and CQC (close quarter combat). What do you mean it’s not possible to do this in an armed fight? You can do it when enemy is wavering or breaking. The knight from Gotham city does it every time after he has frightened the enemy. When executed successfully, it also disarms enemy’s armament (the weapon drops to ground).
Can also be performed when you’re hidden in bush and enemy walks near the bush. If Snake can do it, you can do it too. It has higher success rate if your unspent fatigue is higher than enemy’s (as it’s less likely for a tired person to break off a fresh person’s grapple).
I suggest this weapon because bare fist is too weak, to the extend which surprises me.
On an irrelevant note, would it be the deadliest move in BB if we equip this and use Eye Poke on enemy?
Glass Sword > A transparent sword made of highly reinforced glass. Enemy has hard time to dodge its attack as its movement and weapon reach can’t be determined with eyes. Has +15% chance to hit but has fairly low durability. Consider this a variation of Noble Sword. Yes I said I realize we already have gazillion swords but I just wanna keep this as custom weapon (custom noble sword) for my female brother who is the leader of my group.
“There are many like it, but this one is mine.”
Yes, I suggest us to have custom weapons, which serves as variant to existing weapon. We can have glaive or voulge, which is a variant to another weapon, everything is same except it has different art and slightly different tradeoff in stats. So you can choose a beautiful variant which has the best tradeoff to suit your playstyle. Now we can have eye candy and our “personal” weapon.
I also wish to order equipments in city for triple price. I don’t want to wait like 30 days to get a specific equipment. This might be more useful when we have a wide variety of equipments.
Please slap me next time I suggest a sword related weapon, again. On second thought, forget what I’ve just said. I don’t want to die with a swollen face. I think I’m a little obsessed with blades, probably as much as OP likes polearms.
So as I pray….
unlimited blade works.
There are like 30 types of long sticks with a sharp metal on top of it. If you ask a child whether they are all the same thing….
You’ve mentioned about anti armor, swipe, sweep and stun. Let’s divide 30 by 4….
If someone can provide unique(or rather distinguishable) effect and visual design to these 30 types of weapon…..
Please contact me, I want to show my adoration and respect to this game staff.
Devs say female brothers might be added in future. So here are my suggested weapons which are less masculine and tailor-made for female brothers.
I’ve come with up a slightly distinguishable attack for each suggested weapon (well, don’t expect me to think 2 attacks)
Lance – has range of 2 tile but reduce to 1 when enemy is 1 tile away (long and bulky weapon is not that nimble in close range). It’s special attack “Joust”, uses 6 AP and knock backs enemy while dealing dmg to them. It can only be used right after you move towards the target, in the same turn. So to use this attack, you can’t wait turn between moving and attacking. (think of it as a full sprint charging attack with no interval of hesitation). Also, it can’t be used when there’s height difference.
Scythe – it’s special attack “Reap”, uses 6 AP and can only be used when you’ve waited a turn without taking any action (think of it as some of charged attack which you focus all your concentration into it). It increase chance to hit by 5% and can hit up to 4 targets. It deals incredibly high damage but diminishes as it cut through enemies in a swing. If enemy being hit survived the attack, the attack stops immediately.
Don’t get me wrong, I absolutely love the original/first post because of the amount of information it provides.
There’s never enough variety or customization for weapon. The problem is… how to do it nicely O|¯|_
>> I really don’t understand this line of reasoning, I find variety helps the immersion tremendously.
I also like weapons a lot, too bad I’m just a piece of sh….. but not some sort of expert weapon designers.
Ah, now I get it…
“+5 resolve at positive morale check”
So what happens to the resolve increment after a positive morale check? Does it stay throughout the battle, or does it revert to original value? Maybe it’s just me, but I find the description slightly ambiguous until you’ve explained it to me.
Well, sorry and thanks again.
Because skill description doesn’t state whether it is guaranteed or by chance, and it just doesn’t happen in my previous experiment due to its low trigger rate so I didn’t notice this.
I tested this just now and it worked fine. 11 proc per 52 hits to armor = about 20% trigger rate.
Sorry and thanks.
Yes I realize resolve affects chance to increase morale in battle. Morale can easily change depends on battle situation, but resolve will usually stay constant.
Question: If a brother has Optimist trait and 50 resolve before he enters battle, is it possible that his resolve (not morale) value stay constant after killing 5 enemies?
In my case it doesn’t change that’s why I’m surprised. Also, if I keep killing enemies (positive morale check), does Optimism increases my resolve indefinitely? (yes I realize this might not be meaningful because your morale can’t get higher than Confident)
yup I have this problem too.
Before I begin to ask questions…… just one thing. Are you’re talking to me or Asterix_von_TWC? Since you’re explaining scaled aging, you’re answering my question. But later you’re disagreeing age system, so you must be talking to Asterix. But you can’t be talking to two people in a same paragraph….. What am I missing here?
>> He meant scaled aging like a lot of games have
(I can’t believe I got distracted and to forgot to ask this…)
What is scaled aging? Is aging system that common in most games? Likely limited by my preference and genre of games of I’ve played, I can’t recall games with aging system all of a sudden.
>> A year is still 365 days long, it will still take hmm… a while…
*staring at my previous post*
*then stare at the post before it*
(Hmm…… I wonder if he’s talking to me or awaiting my response? Anyway, I’ve more or less related thoughts to supplement to the age topic.)
Hi gaiz :D it’s me again! ……….why the long face?
If I remember correctly, when my brother was dying (5/60hp), which equivalents to 90% injury, HE ONLY TOOK about 50 in-game hours to heal completely.
Well…. if anyone in reality suffers 90% injury…..
It should take longer time than this for them to heal. Hmmm….. I’m not a doctor but I think It should take 53 ~ 55 hours for him to heal up, BUT DEFINITELY NOT 50 HOURS.
By now you should see there are 100 excuses to modify the time system just to implement age system, without 1 good purpose to support it.
Like I’ve stated and shown in my previous post, this game’s story is about several months long.
If a game allows your character to age, it must be expecting him to accomplish different kind of things that can only be done in a very long duration. The game probably wasn’t expecting your character to age by doing the same thing every day (for example, hunting down every enemy in endless mode, even if enemy is not endless). Why things like that aren’t allowed, you asked? BECAUSE IT WOULD BE TOO SAD. Don’t we age by doing the same thing every day in reality? O|¯|_
If this game is about a mercenary band turning into a legend by saving human civilization from brink of destruction, it would be different story. You can spend 50 years to rebuild towns, restoring prosperity in human society, correcting power balance between factions, and change human’s positioning in the world. You’re basically shaping the world and rewriting history. How could that happen when you’re not even a royalty or ruler? The location you choose to protect might turn from a town into capital, not because you any have say in it, just because the place is safe and the timing is appropriate. You’re just a small cog that happens to turn the wheel of fate, in the way you couldn’t imagine.
The founders of your group have always been bluffing about earning sufficient wealth to build a castle of their own on the most beautiful land by reclaiming it from by orcs. Time elapsed and era has changed. Now the founders have all passed away, none has fulfilled the promise to reclaim the land, but they have accumulated more than enough crowns for a castle and servants. And their fellow brothers are still pursuing the same dream, which has been passed down as legacy.
Why can’t we have DLC like this!? The meaning of early access, you ask? Wait a minute, I’ll google it.
щ(ºДºщ) People~~~ come and
buysupport this game!!!
The moment I saw how caravans impact the town’s economy, and how mercenaries can impact caravan, I see a lot of potential in this game.
It can handle both battle element and city building element while having an interesting relationship between them.
On an irrelevant note, I just encountered a withered vampire for the first time, oh boy I’m excited!
Since you gaiz are so interested about the age thing, here was what the devs had said.
Q: How does the game deal with the passing of time? Do characters age and get physically weaker over time and age?
The whole game takes places over a period of several months, not years. Aging isn’t a part of the game and most of the Battle Brothers will die before having the chance to grow old anyway.
This game gives me similar impression before I read the FAQ.
But the game can be something like this too…
Reim Century 12
This land is roamed by undead and orcs. Humans, a lesser clan and easy prey to various predators. Some intellectuals of the kin believe extinction will arrive in several decades. The situation is dire enough for most people to give up hope in restoration of mankind. The hopelessness ultimately turns into malice and madness, which given rise to bandits. This has greatly prevented resource from falling into the hands of predators, in the most ironic way.
Reim Century 14
Questioning your past, you and your brothers took up the sword to search for an answer. Nonetheless, your group is merely hired blades with suspicious background in the eyes of many.
– as frontier in mercenary business, your active participation will catalyze its growth, which increases the amount of mercenary groups available
– plantation field is a good source of provision, make sure enemy does not destroy it
– river is another source for food, if the place is secured, new towns could be built there
– securing trading routes enables towns to exchange commodities such provisions and weapons.
– in messenger quest, make sure structure plans arrive safely, it greatly helps the town development
– as you retrieve artifacts for scholars, you might learn unrevealed history, such as Orcs and Undead didn’t exist until one day….
– when even royal army has failed to hold the line, it’s up to you fend off the invading army.
– by retrieving lost history records, you might find the mastermind behind all this, if there’s one.
– focus your defense on a single town when everywhere else cannot be protected, but make there’s a safe route for everyone to fall back to this town. Refugees holing up in this town will turn it into a citadel, where you can keep defending it until you come up a good plan to strike back.
– attacking orc’s supply unit or strategic spot to give enough advantage for royal army to turn the tide of the battle
– find out the weakness of indomitable undead army by venturing deep into their area
– restoring faith in humanity by completing one of the most impossible quests. This inspires and motivates human to expand their power.
– explore the coldest place to find surprises you wouldn’t imagine
– loading your cleared save in new game plus will advance the time by 10 years, the result will be an extension to previous events by taking all factors into account, but the changes may or may not favor you.
– try completing the personal goal of a brother. It can be accumulation of wealth, gaining fame, or reclaiming his homeland.
– the shared goal of you group has no time limit, and it can be passed down to next generations
– will you wipe out every clan other than humans? Or is there a way to co-exist with them?
The hands you used to hold weapon…. has the power to shape the world too.
- Battle Brothers: War of Century –
(￣◇￣;) If we have that much game content, aging system might be relevant and fun.
This is a long post with almost no useful information. Please scroll down until you see the next black bar to skip this post.
>> You can enter 3 way battles by attacking the enemy that has a different enemy faction unit near by so it will be drawn into the battle. Or join an already ongoing battle between 2 enemy factions. Same goes for human patrools and caravans, you can draw them in even in fort attacks that are near the road.
>> Easiest way to see this is at the very start, after accepting the quest and gearing up just wait for the settlement to pop out a caravan or depending of the road-hideout position even 2-3 caravans and attack, all of them will be forced to help.
When you start a game you spwan next to a settlement that has always the tutorial job for destroying a bandit hideout next to this settlement. Now since it is randomly generated the positioning of this settlement, the road, and the hideout will differ. Usualy when a caravan is spawned and you attack this hideout the caravan will fight since it is in the support radius. Now sometimes the road goes next to the hideout and the settlement may spawn more than one caravan, you can catch em all in the hideout battle.
Yes I knew about the forced involvement feature related to battle. The thing I don’t understand is….
The essential elements that form a 3 way battle are enemy faction A, enemy faction B and you, right? So why do you need the caravan anyway? Because the caravan could lure out these enemies easier?
Incidentally, I’ve just happen to encounter a 3 way battle(different enemy factions are fighting over a town between their areas), and I discovered a problem.
The scout report doesn’t report about orcs at all, probably due to lack of space. You see, I’m not really complaining about the free scout. But I would be happy to pay crowns to hire a better one.
>> Ofc just skipping turn and hoping for the most possible casualties on both sides. Just a small boost at the start. It is an exploit in my eyes and should be fixed, but untill then…
This is actually a tricky situation. For example, when you’re fighting with an enemy faction, you discover the appearance of new enemy faction. They just stand far away and do nothing. What should you do? Would you keep fighting or ask the enemy for a break? I’ve never experience things like this but if I were you…. I won’t stop fighting. Because I have no choice. I won’t ask the enemy for a temporary truce, and I won’t believe the enemy if he’s proposing one. Who can guarantee it isn’t a lie? What if he swings his weapon when I have lower my guard? Besides, can you imagine having truce with bloodthirsty orcs? And you’ve just slain some of their men too.
I believe skipping turn and hoping for the most possible casualties on both sides is a justifiable and feasible act.
– – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – –
O F F T O P I C
HOWEVER, truce can be made if leaders from both sides have very high EQ and leadership. Please be patient as this explanation will be a little long. For example, You(Sky) as the merc leader, are fighting with the bandit leader, GOD. Then you saw another bandit faction standing aside and doing nothing.
*Two men having conversation as they dance with swords and shields.*
Sky: Hey… did you see what I see?
GOD: …….little bit- beach standing over there, waiting to rip us off.
Sky: So no matter who wins this fight, we still lose(die).
GOD: ……….can you me tell something more obvious than that?
Sky: Tsk! We don’t have time for satires! There will be no truce when one of our men dies!! So are you with me!!??
GOD: Hmph. You’ve been granted the permission to live a little longer.
*Then the two men order their brothers to stop fighting each other*
*After a brief moment, the combined force has routed the sly bandit group successfully, with a little more trouble than expected*
Sky: Hey….*smile* You’re pretty good.
GOD: Good try. I’ve been considering of sparing your life for a second.
Sky: So…. you wanna continue where we left off?
GOD: You look pretty worn now. I’ve no intention of bullying the weak. Just get out of my sight before I change my mind. I will kill you the next time I see you loitering on the road.
Sky: Say, why did you………. Nothing, I’ve be leaving now.
*He wanted to ask the reason why the bandit leader became a bandit, but he held back.*
*The merc leader and his men are leaving slowly, then he turns back and let out a cry of soul*
Sky: HEYYY~~~~~ YOU TOO~~~~~!!!! *smile* Don’t get killed~~~ By other merc before~~~~~ I lay my hands on you~~~~~
*The bandit leader did not reply, he quietly stares at the direction where the merc group vanishes.*
*Meanwhile, a bandit has found something wrong with another fellow bandit.*
Bandit A: ……..hey, what’s wrong? You look deadly surprised. You got stabbed in the tummy?
Bandit B: Am I seeing things? B-Boss has smiled…
– to be continued? –
Suddenly, this game has become really fishy…. (≖╻≖；) I always wanted some bromance in this game….. but now I’m not sure if I want it anymore… ヾ(´･ ･｀｡)ノ”
>> Same mechanic goes for other near the road enemy camps, you can suck in the patrols and caravans into a camp ambush. Same exploit.
Sucking in patrols is fine because they have a sense of duty to keep the area safe, so they will aid you. But I don’t think they should aid you in raiding base, because it make more sense if the patrols report the hidedout and gather more men before they attack the enemy stronghold.
>> Or you can simply follow around a strong caravan or patrol vulturing all fights even jumping in for a last hit exp steal. Same exploit.
To me, kill/exp steal in such fashion is not an exploit. You’re just a very bad person that schemes to take credits with a plan. Acting like some sort of merc which happens to pass by the area and saved the caravan, while you’re actually been following it. You get some crowns (as a token of appreciation) and the title of savior. I won’t do such lowly things but I think it makes senses.
Regarding this matter, I found something else which makes less sense. This game will give you loot/equipment even you do nothing at all (or just skipping turns while staying at corners) in a co-op battle, if your allied force emerged victorious. This can only be explained if you insist it. The caravan never expect they can survive such tough fight, they’re unusually happy/hyped today so they decided to share the joy by giving you some equipment/supplies, even if you’ve done nothing at all.
щ(ºДºщ) Caravans~~~~ Why are you so generous!?
>> Now for the quoting. When you quote a message it starts with quote and the number of post(next to the quote button) while ends with /quote. All you have to do is place the same [ quote=xxxx] and [ /quote] around every chunk of text you want to quote separately.
O|¯|_ Ugh… It’s a little troublesome. I better forget it, sorry for your trouble though. Where did you learn this BB code? Do you know the code for spoiler? The BB code from different site doesn’t work here.
>> While playing now forgot to buy food, first time ever to have someone desert my ranks…
*passionate staring eyes slowly turns into cold judging eyes*
If you’re not doing it for experimental purpose…. I dunno what to say. All I can do is to cheer you up with some laughter.
(Hahahahaha~~~~~~ look at this guy~~~~~~ dear GOD~~~~ I can’t stop laughing~~~~)
I hope you felt better now.
>> Now the party was already beaten over and over having 4lvl 11 and the rest 1-4lvl. Ofc the only one who deserts is my lvl 11 main leader type guy… And he was a founder aswell.
Damn. I wish my team has someone like that. When the team has almost nothing to eat, he left quietly, so there is more food for everyone to share. And he took all the blame just like that. Must be one hell of man.
You say your party was beaten not long ago, right? I bet he did all this because he doesn’t want to see any brothers to die in front of him anymore.
>> Why did he even participate in forming the mercenary group if he’s the first one to run…
Divorced people are judging you.
>> Not to mention his title was “Fearless”… What a lier.
A fearless person doesn’t take less damage from a slash or have higher resistance against pain/suffering/starvation. He is simply oblivious or ignorant to these threats until they hit him. This is probably the difference of being fearless and having strong will.
He lives up to his name depends how you think. He wasn’t afraid to leave the team despite he knew his buddies are going to badmouth about him. Not caring what other says actually takes far more courage than what you think, especially if they’re close to you.
>> And if that was not enought he took all the gear with him. Heraldic mail, full helm, noble sword… I want to capture and murder him.
When you’ve no food to eat and dying…. who needs these stuff anyway? Especially when these are heavy equipments. Unless you wanna test your limits by carrying heavy burden when you’re insanely hungry.
Everything indicates it’s just some bad acting to take all the blame. So his brothers can split his share of food without a sense of guilt.
Mercenary is such troublesome creature. Why can’t they just say what they think? You’re just worried about him. Is it so difficult to say it?
>> Why is that not in the game.
The game says I might find my expelled buddy in tavern or something, but I’ve never seen it before. It would be fun if we have a chance to meet them elsewhere in future. Imagine you’re overwhelmed by a large group of orcs, when you never expect a valiant guard captain would stand between you and the orc leader, while you’re lying on ground, waiting for impending death. You suddenly realize his outfit is slightly different from standard guard captains. That heraldic mail, and that full helm, everything looks so familiar…. and his silhouette looks taller and braver than anything else.
Someone really need to teach how to use a spoiler ASAP….